Martyn Lloyd-Jones: Being dead, yet speaks

It was this very week thirty-five years ago - 1^st March 1981 to be exact- when the beloved Welsh preacher Dr. Martyn Lloyd-Jones went to be with the Lord.

Ironically it is now when the ‘Prince of Expositors’ is becoming increasingly popular on a global scale. Thanks to the great resurgence of the Protestant faith throughout the Hispanic world, Lloyd-Jones’ books are in constant demand. Being dead, the man of the God yet speaks.

To commemorate his legacy, we have with us today one of his contemporary followers, namely, Pedro Blois, a 32-year-old pastor who is serving the Lord in Granada (southern Spain). As well as pastoring in his local church ‘Luz a las naciones’ (Light to the Nations), Blois also ministers in the ‘Escuela Teológica de Granda’ (Granada Theological School) and is a well-known Bible expositor.

Let’s move on to the interview.

Will Graham (WG): Brother Pedro, great to have you with us today.

Pedro Blois (PB): It’s great to be here and especially to be talking about a man whom the Lord has used to much to bless my life: Dr. Martyn Lloyd-Jones (MLJ).

WG: Great. Well, to start, why don’t you begin by telling us a little bit about the Doctor’s life?

PB: He was a man who was thoroughly subjected to the Word of the Lord. He delighted in the Law of the Lord and meditated upon it day and night. In my opinion he was one of greatest Bible preachers and expositors in the twentieth-century.

Born in Cardiff on 20^th December 1899, he spent his childhood in a Welsh town named Llangeitho. Llangeitho was also where the Welsh minister Daniel Rowland (1713-1790) was born and ministered. MLJ felt the strong influence of revival that prevailed in his town. In 1917 he started his medical studies at St. Bartholomew’s Hospital and in 1921 he began to work as an assistant to the royal physician, Sir Thomas Horder.

After going through a few years of conflict with regards to his calling to the ministry, MLJ headed back to Wales where he married Bethan Phillips (with whom he would have two daughters: Elizabeth and Ann) and he also accepted the call to pastor a church in Aberavon (Port Talbot). He ministered there for ten years before becoming the associate pastor at Westminster Chapel (London) where he served alongside G. Campbell Morgan (who retired in 1943). MLJ’s ordination was the day after the outbreak of the Second World War. They were turbulent times for anyone involved in ministerial work! It was from his London pulpit that Doctor MLJ soon became the most influential preacher of his generation and his voice continues speaking today.

1968 was the year he retired, leaving behind a fruitful 25 years of ministry at Westminster. In the following years, he preached itinerantly, edited books and carried out various pastoral chores. The Lord was pleased to take him to His presence on 1^st March 1981.

That is, in essence, a brief introduction to the life of that extraordinary man of God.

WG: That’s fantastic. And what is it that makes MLJ so unique and special?

PB: Great question! It would help if we began with a negative statement. In a sense, everything that has to do with MLJ’s ministry seems so normal. Let explain what I mean by that. We’re not dealing with an overly charismatic man. He was, after all, a physician. He was of an analytic nature. He certainly didn’t have an overpowering personal presence. His gifts weren’t overly extravagant neither was his manner of speech at all amusing. Just to let you know what kind of man he was: he never took his suit and tie off. Not even when he went to the beach! Some say he started a new fashion style amongst the youth. With respect to the content of his message, he taught the Bible through and through, offering pure exegesis of the text and simple Gospel preaching. He had no tricks up his sleeve: no strange interpretations of the text, no enthralling stories or anything of the sort. He didn’t believe in gimmicks.

WG: What was it then Pedro? What made him so special?

PB: Oh, Will! We could say of this man: “My preaching was not with persuasive words of human wisdom but with the demonstration and power of the Holy Ghost so that your faith should not be in the wisdom of men but in the power of God” (1 Corinthians 2:4-5). The Doc knew that the highest calling of a preacher was to dig deep into Scripture and to make it known. There, and only there, is where true power resides! His only concern was to lift the Word of God up high. Such was the urgency of his message that his hearers knew that God was speaking through him and they felt obliged to respond. Many folk who knew him, for example, the renowned theologian J.I. Packer, affirmed that they had never known a man so full of the Spirit as MLJ. His daughter remembers him as a man who ministered as in the presence of God. Do you get that, Will? That is what made all the difference! There is nothing more to add! There were no professional strategies or skilful manoeuvring or artistic tricks. He had godliness: that’s all. The precious and rare jewel of godliness!

I should also point out that MLJ had a mighty intellect. His years of study developed his analytic skills and this explains how he expounded his ideas so profoundly. But I go back to what I said before: MLJ was a godly man. He was the mouthpiece of a type of godliness that is wholly submitted to the Word of God.

WG: Amazing! Why do you think his books are still selling so many copies thirty-five years after his death?

PB: Well, Will, I heard a little bird say that you yourself are reading his sermons upon the epistle to the Romans. How exciting!

WG: Yes, it’s true. My wife bought me the Romans collection for Christmas. She is a truly virtuous woman!

PB: Well, I had the blessing of receiving that selfsame collection when I was in ministerial training and I often say that his ‘Romans’ was my Seminary. His books keep selling because they are pure Bible exposition. And when there’s a revival of interest in the Word of God amongst the Lord’s people, MLJ’s books sell. Just take one of his books like ‘Psalm 51’ or ‘Psalm 73’ or ‘The Sermon on the Mount’ and what you’ve got is the Bible in all of purity, explained and applied with power. What more can you ask from a book?

I think his books are so popular because they deal with the Bible in a deep exegetical style which was the chief characteristic of the Doctor. MLJ studied the Bible with the precision of a surgeon and the heart of a good GP. Furthermore, he did all that without falling into technicalities and linguistic complexities. His books are transcribed versions of his sermons and he always tried to explain the truth with great simplicity and then apply it to the hearts of the people. You know, Will, I used to think that writing simply and touching hearts was just a matter of having clear thoughts and good training as a teacher. And I still believe that it’s true. As Calvin says, “I study a lot to be simple”. But I’ve also come to realize that godliness is a necessary ingredient in all of this. When one reads MLJ, his biblical expositions seem to reveal the purity of his holy desire before the Lord. His whole intention was to save sinners and to feed the Lord’s hungry sheep. All this made his language simple and his content unadulterated. I thank God for men whose godliness makes them write plainly and point at the heart!

WG: What importance did MLJ give to the Word and to the pulpit?

PB: MLJ repeated time and time again that preaching is worship. He certainly didn’t agree with the division we tend to draw between ‘worship time’ and ‘sermon time’. For him, it was all worship and everything had to be centred upon the Word. Even in his Friday night doctrinal classes, he used to say that they were worshipping. There was no distinction whatsoever between a Bible lesson and a worship meeting! Everything was worship! Every time the Bible was opened, there had to be worship. Just think about this, Will, as far as MLJ was concerned, a meeting that had more than a half-an-hour of singing was unbalanced! He thought that nothing was more important than the preached Word. It’s the preaching of the Word that convicts us of sin and saves sinners. Every time the Doctor preached, he expected great things to happen by the power of the Spirit. He preached expecting revival. Such was his conviction that he turned down the opportunity to preach on radio shows. According to the Doctor, preaching a limited time upon radio was a big problem because he couldn’t imagine what he would do if the Holy Spirit were suddenly to descend upon him! That was MLJ!

WG: Now that you’ve touched upon the theme of the pulpit, could you tell us a little bit about the characteristics of his preaching?

PB: First and foremost, he was a slave of the biblical text. He dealt deeply and carefully with Scripture. We may not agree with all of his textual analysis, but there can be no doubting his earnestness and concern for the Word.

Secondly, whilst preaching, he always expected a divine intervention. As I said before, the Doctor preached expecting God to move with power. By the way, MLJ’s definition of preaching is theology coming through a man on fire.

Thirdly, his preaching was apologetic in that the Doctor always knew what was going on in the world around him and he gave answers to its needs.

Fourthly, his preaching aimed at the heart. MLJ, following the lead of the Puritans, was a soul-physician. One of his key premises was that every problem is, at its root, a theological problem. This belief led him to diagnose situations correctly and biblically. He was never satisfied with mere psychological or sociological solutions. He wanted to press on to theology! He had to press on to the theological man!

Fifthly, his preaching was evangelistic. The cross had to be the centre of every sermon. He thought it was a terrible error to believe that all who attend church are true believers. At any rate, he believed that believers are being saved by the same Gospel that one day saved them! It is said that on a certain occasion he was going to preach upon the Law on a given Sunday morning and then share the Gospel that Sunday night. But that afternoon there was a fire in a London factory which claimed the lives of a few men. That event led the Doctor to think about what would have happened had one of those men been at the Sunday morning service. They would not have heard the message of salvation! From that moment on, MLJ decided to preach the complete Gospel in every sermon.

Pedro Blois, preaching in Granada.

WG: And what about his prayer life, Pedro?

PB: I think the best person to ask that question to is his wife. She used to say that rather than being a preacher or an expositor, MLJ was first and foremost an evangelist and a man of prayer. If your wife says you’re a man of prayer, you’re on the right track! Before I pointed out how godliness was the great characteristic of this man of God. Although he didn’t have an overpowering charismatic personality, those who know him knew that God was present in his life. MLJ also believed in the baptism of the Holy Spirit as a post-conversion experience. He believed that it was a thoroughly experiential affair –an experience of filial love with the same class of love that the Father has for us. He preached that and encouraged believers to seek after the internal testimony of the Holy Spirit; the fullness of the Spirit that fills the soul with joy unspeakable and divine boldness to bear witness to the faith.

As a child, MLJ had been strongly influenced by the fruits of the Welsh revival. We can perceive this influence in his sermons and ministry. He always prayed and preached for revival. His desire was to see an outpouring of the Holy Ghost by which men are convicted of sin and drawn to the cross. One of his frustrations was having died without seeing it come to pass. At any rate, he lit the flame for revival wherever he went and the same flame is still ablaze in my heart thanks, in part, to his ministry.

WG: Was he more of a church man or an academic?

PB: That’s a good question. I think the Doctor fused the both of best worlds into one. His main priority was to be a pastor. His leading concern was to bring people to the cross and to feed the Lord’s flock. But he was also a great academic. He became the president of the Inter-Varsity Fellowship of Students (a renowned ministry amongst British university students). We can also read his addresses from the annual Puritan conferences to see the riches of his historical and theological knowledge on display. Those yearly conferences brought together great thinkers and young ministers to discuss the legacy of the Puritans and to apply their valuable insights to their own context.

The erudition of the Doctor can also be appreciated in his sermons. Each one of his messages reveals a vast amount of learning. As well as being a physician by trade, he had a sharp insight into the distinct complexities at work within the human soul. He treated emotional problems with particular care (one such example would be in his book ‘Spiritual Depression’). Something that never ceases to impress me is the insight he had with regards to the world and church of his time. Whether he looked at the church or at the world, he spoke as a true prophet. He understood all reality from the perspective of God and His Word.

In spite of being an academic, MLJ stood against any type of dead erudition. His strong emphasis on Calvinistic doctrines such as total depravity or the sovereign grace of God revealed in salvation made him put a limit on man’s knowledge and capacities. He was by no means an anti-intellectual, but he was a man who knew that salvation depends upon the foolishness of preaching which, much unlike erudition, depended entirely upon the power of God.

WG: In what sense do you think MLJ can help the contemporary church?

PB: To answer that question, I’d have to recall a few things I said earlier. First of all, his stress upon the centrality of preaching in the church’s life is fundamental. He called preaching the first task of the church and its ministers. Everything else should be subjected to that task and flow from it. We need pastors who take the pulpit seriously and who put all their effort into transmitting the message of the biblical text. We would do well to axe church activities that downplay pulpit ministry.

Secondly, the Doctor reminds us constantly of our desperate need of the Spirit of God. We are all continually tempted to look for substitutes for the Spirit’s power. The problem is that there aren’t any! MLJ knew so. He pointed out that if there’s no fire burning on the altar, it doesn’t make a shadow of a difference what we put on it. It won’t burn. We need the power of God!

Thirdly, we need theological depth and application knowhow. MLJ was eminently practical. His was a pastoral theology, a theology that aimed at the heart. In our days, one almost gets the impression that it’s either/or: either a theological depth that doesn’t have anything to do with human reality or a superficial practical theology that goes no more than surface-deep. We should follow MLJ’s example and combine the two realities.

Finally, we need godly men. MLJ was a man of prayer who led an integral life and loved his family. May the Lord grant us ministers and Christians of such caliber!

WG: Maybe I could dare to ask you a more personal question. In what way has MLJ affected your life Pedro?

PB: One of the greatest gifts I ever got for my theological training were MLJ’s expositions upon Romans. I had only turned twenty at the time. By then, I had experienced a true conversion; but I didn’t have a clear understanding of the Gospel. Once I started reading his sermons, doctrines such as total depravity, the righteousness which comes by faith, election or effectual calling started to hammer their way through my heart of stone and, at the same time, brought me a soothing balm of healing. MLJ paused verse by verse, word by word. He didn’t worry about repeating the same doctrine a thousand times. As a good teacher who knows all about the blindness of our eyes and our hardness of heart, he developed the same truths over and over again. So little by little the Spirit opened the eyes of my heart and the glorious Gospel of God –the Gospel which speaks of the terrible reality of sin and the glorious gift of grace- started to inject into my heart an ever greater joy. Without a shadow of a doubt, Will, MLJ was a God-given instrument to teach me the Gospel.

WG: To wrap up, brother, could you recommend us two or three must-read books by MLJ?

PB: Before recommending two or three, I would say: read all the works of MLJ you can! Reading any of his sermons is always so beneficial. As well as growing in biblical knowledge, one learns how to study the Bible. The Doctor was so systematic in his approach to Scripture that after reading some of his sermons, one learns how to study the Bible. It’s amazing! So I recommend you to read anything you can get your hands on by MLJ. Here is a list of books to start:

1.- The Sermon on the Mount.

2.- Spiritual Depression.

3.- God the Holy Spirit.

4.- Out of the Depths (his exposition of Psalm 51).

5.- Preaching and preachers.

WG: Excellent. Thanks a lot for your time today, brother. I’m sure the interview will be a huge blessing for many. You’ve blessed me so much with what you’ve shared.